Episode Transcript
[00:00:02] Speaker A: Welcome to the Love justice podcast, where we hear from different voices who are joining us in the fight against modern day slavery. Please welcome today's guests, Brian A. Fickling and Shawn Mullins.
[00:00:16] Speaker B: Well, hey, welcome to the Love justice podcast. My name is Jason Dukes, and my co host with me today is Hannah Munn. Hannah, how are you doing?
[00:00:26] Speaker C: I'm doing good. How are you, Jason?
[00:00:28] Speaker B: Doing great. It's great to be back on with you and excited about our guests today, and I'm going to let them introduce themselves. Bryony and Sean, tell us a little bit about what you do, who you are, and what you do with love justice.
[00:00:45] Speaker D: I am the senior director of anti trafficking, and I'm very lucky to get to work with some amazing people all over the world.
[00:00:54] Speaker A: Yeah. And I'm Sean. Sean Mullins. I've worked with the love justice team. I should call it family, the love justice family for just over three years now, and love what I do. I'm involved in champion recruitment and looking at our new pilots and where to expand to and just building relationships with people who are passionate about fighting injustice with us. We share our values and going on the front lines and meeting new people and sharing our mission with them and seeing if they'll partner with us to do that. I've also been a regional steward for West Africa, but really love building relationships, inviting people on mission with us.
[00:01:35] Speaker C: Yeah. What these guys aren't saying, Jason, is that they're foundations to the Love justice program staff.
Actually, Sean, I'm surprised that you've only been around for three years. It feels like so much longer than that. And Bryan's been around, what, for almost five years, if not a little bit more. Yeah, yeah. So these guys have been around for a long time, and specifically through our expansion, which we'll get into a little bit later in this episode. But our listeners are in for a real, real treat today.
Bryony, can you tell us what are the two common strategies to fighting human trafficking?
[00:02:16] Speaker D: Absolutely.
There are pre trafficking activities that happen sort of in the area of pre exploitation, so before someone has been exploited.
And generally these consist of awareness and empowerment strategies like job creation or skills training, etcetera. And then you have post trafficking activities, which is after exploitation, after abuse, after slavery has happened. And generally these relate to rescue operations or caring for victims, helping victims to reintegrate, and often rehabilitate. There's a lot of healing involved in that journey as well. Both are really important, and we work alongside some great and special people who work in these sides of anti trafficking.
[00:03:17] Speaker C: Yeah. And to piggyback off of that, you have these two common strategies, but yet love justice specifically chose something that didn't fall within those two categories. Can you tell us a little bit more about why that is and the pros and cons to maybe each sides of those strategies and where we found ourselves specifically doing transit monitoring?
[00:03:37] Speaker D: Absolutely. Hannah and I kind of love being able to talk about this because I have been fully convinced myself that this kind of niche or this gap is just so incredibly important.
And I'm excited to, I think, bring more people along on that journey as well. So while pre trafficking and post trafficking activities are really important, if we look at post exploitation activities like resuse and rehabilitation, reintegration, unfortunately, it's post exploitation. Right. That's exactly what the problem with it is, is that the damage has been done. And while it's so important that there are services and people to kind of really help and love victims and to go to extraordinary lengths, I think, to save even one person, unfortunately, the exploitation, the abuse of the violence, the hurt, the crime has already happened to a degree where healing from something like that is extraordinarily difficult, where rescuing is very difficult, where escaping is really difficult.
And so the human cast, I think, both for the victim but also for operations in that space, is extremely high. Then, on the other hand, pre trafficking activities kind of focus on really good things, right? They're arguably not bad, but the real impact in terms of no way and how much human trafficking is actually prevented by these activities, given the sheer cost and I think the sheer scale at which they have to happen in order to reach potential victims of human trafficking, kind of impossible to know. And so the love justice approaches is really a strategy that is aimed at looking for active cases of human trafficking. People who are on their way to be trafficked, but have not yet been trafficked. So the exploitation, the enslavement, has not yet happened.
I like to refer to it as the last line of defense, which is a sports megaphone. And if you watch football or soccer, it's kind of like being the goalie, right? Being that last line of defense. As someone is on their way to being trafficked. They're at a bus terminal waiting for their bus to meet their trafficker. They are crossing a land border on their way to a whole different country, in a language and a culture that they don't know, to pursue this opportunity that they've been offered, that's kind of just too good to be true or shows clear signs of potential enslavement if they get there. And our monitoring teams truly are the heroes of this work. And they're the people who are at these land borders, airports, taxi racks. They're the ones looking out for visual signs of human trafficking. Sometimes they're just talking to people, finding out, where are you going? What have you been promised? What are you expecting? Can we help you verify some of these opportunities? And so I think that's what I love most about this model, is that the monitors really are going the absolute extra mile to find people. They're talking to probably 100 people, if not more, before they find a potential victim. The amount of work that they go to in harsh conditions, in difficult places is extraordinarily just, I think, impressive.
And I'd love to go into some of the real perks that I see about this model and why I am so bought into it in particular. But we have a really high confidence that the cases that our teams are working on would have resulted in human trafficking had it not been for that monitor. Also, the data collection and data verification processes are really rigorous and enable us to really be able to say with confidence that there is some tangible impact, that there is real prevention in this model that we call transit monitoring.
And the data that we can collect, because it's an active case of human trafficking, is just different to other awareness activities where you're just not getting that data because the suspect hasn't yet reached out to a potential victim, the crime has not yet started to take place. And so we're able to facilitate arrests and convictions pre exploitation, which I think is just extraordinary because of the data that the monitors are collecting. And then the last and really important aspect for it, for me, is just the cost effectiveness of this model. I think it is the most cost efficient solution to one of the world's greatest injustices that we know of. And I love what the teams that we partner with across the world are doing to keep their costs low, to think of innovative ways to get potential victims home in really cost effective manners. And that cost per intercept is just decreasing month on month on month because of this sort of drive to spend our resources really wisely, where it's either directly going to beneficiaries of this work or it's going to create an impact to reach more beneficiaries of this work. So I just think as a model to prevent one of the world's greatest injustices, it's, you get banned for your back, man. Like, it blows my mind that put $200, you can save a life like a whole family, a whole generation of a family forever changed. It's just extraordinary.
[00:09:57] Speaker B: No question about it. And I think there's so much of what you said, which is so good, that I want to hit on. I mean, one thing I think that amazes me is how much money over a specific three year period of time was spent on the rescue and that rescue side, the side of human trafficking or fighting human trafficking, where you go after someone that's already been in that enslavement or that's been exploited.
One organization estimated that over one three year period. And this was like, I think, right before or right over the COVID Covid, the pandemic. But one organization estimated that was over half a billion dollars was spent on the rescue side in that three year period. And when you look at a three year period with transit monitoring, to my knowledge, it's been about $15 million over a three year period.
And yet we've seen significant impact that we can actually measure, that we can look at. And like you said, it's not to say the other side is bad or a bad investment. It's not at all. That's not what we're saying. We know that's needed as well. But I can't imagine with how impactful, how significant, how meaningful this approach is prior to someone being exploited or being enslaved. I can't imagine how much more can be done with just even a little bit more resources of, you know, dedicated toward it and the data side. I was talking to a friend here in the US who is a criminologist and focuses in human trafficking in Arizona and fighting human trafficking, excuse me, in Arizona. And she was talking when I was telling her about the data collection and analysis that we do and how we're able to get the old time looks into what this is like and where these people have come from and who these potential victims are and who these traffickers are. And she was just amazed at that. And so before we jump to Sean on just the roles that are played here, Bryony, do talk about those perks. I mean, talk about why that particular approach is so significant, because it can.
[00:12:19] Speaker D: Actually disrupt human trafficking forever. I am 1000% convinced that the data that we have seen throughout the journey at Love Justice International tells us that this model has extraordinarily beneficial disruption capacity, but it can only fully disrupt the system once we reach a tipping point. Right? And we don't know where exactly that tipping point is. But I think a model that is scalable, that can be adapted to any context, really. And we've kind of we've got this framework that is adaptable to various contexts across the world, but also in terms of the different types of transit hubs, different types of monitoring. It can be adapted for any situation, any people group really.
But then, on the other hand, is because it's so cost efficient, there is a real probability that if we continue expanding one at the rate that we're going, and increasing our impact sort of month on month on month, year on year, there is this promise of actually being able to fight this world's greatest injustice to the point where we no longer have to fight anymore, to make it so difficult to operate in sort of the space of a trafficking kingpin or a syndicate or whatever it is, the facilitators, whether they're low level or sort of the top guys, to make it so difficult, so expensive, so sort of prohibitive in terms of actually getting real justice as well where suspects are involved.
It is not only possible with this model, it is probable if we continue along the trajectory that we're going. And I think there are very few, if not no other ways to do it as cost effectively as we can. And I'm convinced of that. We just have to be in enough places, enough times, have enough feet on the ground and kind of eyes and ears to be able to do this.
So it's, for me, it's really exciting, and it's just about, it's a matter of time, it's a matter of resources in terms of when we get to that tipping point. But that's why I'm here. That's why I don't see myself going anywhere until we reach that tipping point, because I'm convinced.
[00:15:01] Speaker C: Yeah, one of the reasons I think, Bryony, that you're so convinced is, you know, you just connecting you with the donors who are probably going to be a significant portion of our listeners. You're the one that executes, like, is involved in the faithful execution of those resources, right? Like you have combed through hundreds upon hundreds of financial requests. You have. And like, your, your primary objective has been impact on the dollar when you think about the last year. And so just even hearing you talk about that and hearing how you're not convinced because someone's telling you to be convinced, but because you yourself have been so knee deep in this work and specifically the faithful execution of those resources, I think that's just really powerful for donors to hear that. And there's so much of what you're saying, like, I just. I don't know how you're feeling, Jason, but I'm feeling, I'm buzzing because I'm like, oh, my gosh, that's a cool episode topic. That's a cool episode topic about, you know, all these things that it's like we just have such a short amount of time in this specific episode that Bryony's giving our listeners a tantalizing preview of how much value there is in this model and that we could dive into at any given time. And one thing I wanted to connect before we pivot to Sean, because I love giving practical examples and digestible examples for listeners of what does this actually practically look like? And specifically with the disruption of trafficking networks. We recently, it wasn't me. I'm not going to claim, I'm not going to claim this, but, you know, my husband Austin and Bryony, about a year ago, had met with a well known international bank and shared some suspect data with them because they were interested in partnering with us in a data sharing kind of partnership. And they recently had a meeting with them a couple weeks ago just to get an update on how it's going, how it's been used. And they've actually been able to find in their database and their systems connections to potential illegal activity, to the information that our team was able to give them. So that's just a small, small, small example of how we can see the impact of this. And I feel like God has given us little bits over the last two or three years where we haven't quite hit that breakthrough, but we're given vision for how it can lead to breakthrough. And that's what we all get really excited thinking about, what we all get really excited talking about. And those are the types of things that we can continue to do more of if we have the resources to do it.
[00:17:34] Speaker A: Well.
[00:17:34] Speaker B: Sean, talk about the process of identifying, selecting the different roles that are necessary to execute on this, like to really execute on this incredible prevention model that we give so much of our energy and our attention to. I know there's several that you could talk through here. You know, champion, project manager, transit monitor, local partner, and Brian, even if you want to jump in on any of those, or Hannah, because I think all three of you end up engaging with these, but kind of walk us through briefly just how, what these different roles are so that our listeners can kind of practically understand what really goes on in this model.
[00:18:21] Speaker A: Yeah, well, thank you, Jason. I mean, for us to disrupt trafficking, we truly believe at love, justice, that we've really got to find the right people to do that with, to partner with, and we would say our core competency, what we believe we do well at love justice, is to really find the right people, to search out the right people in the right places and develop and create the best kingdom class tools to have the greatest impact that we can. We talk about impact on the dollar and there are probably four things that we put in place before looking for the right people. So as part of that process, I would say the four things that we do, the first one to do with data is pretty much a predictive analysis, looking at the prevalence of trafficking in different countries around the world and looking where our model might be effective. And so as we do that, we have an amazing team that researches all the different nations around the world and looks at our model and analyzes to see whether our model would work there. And when we find a decent score for a country that, yeah, this model could work there, we look at, okay, what's the impact on the dollar gonna be there? Okay, good. Impact on the dollar. Now we need to look at the level of risk. And so we look at the level of risk that it would be to operate in that country in terms of financial risk and risk to team on the ground. We wouldn't want to put anybody at a high level of security risk without mitigating against those risks. And then we look at the risk and then finally we then say, okay, who can we find as the best potential partner in this nation? And that's where I'll normally come in and looking at all of that research and go to this nation and find out, okay, so who do we know? What is our connection and network like in this particular nation? And we find those kind of relationships through our staff, our team love justice international through reports that we've done, through conferences that we've been through and through local churches we have relationships with and recommendations that come now. Finding the right champion. The champion is essentially the volunteer who says, yeah, I believe in this mission, I can take this on. And that would be the most strategic person that we connect with. And this person would sign an MoU with us. That person, the champion, would usually be on the board of an existing organization that has registration in that country and is prepared to pilot a three month pilot with us in transit monitoring. And we want to find a person who has faith, who's a strong believer, recognized in their community as someone who's quite connected, has some kind of relationship with government and authorities as we seek approvals in that country, relationship with local network of churches and other NGO's or connections with the legal sphere to ensure that we're not just intercepting people from being trafficked and then can be retrafficked, but actually fighting this injustice by getting. By helping the authorities to get arrests and then take these cases to court and secure convictions against traffickers. Because we believe that's really where the meat of fighting this injustice is, or where we really will kind of disrupt trafficking is through the courts and getting cases against these kinds of. Against this great injustice and these criminals. But we want to provide great care for what we would say potential victims of trafficking. When I say potential victims, I say that because it's pre exploitation. Right. We really want to intercept before exploitation happens and making sure that our teams have a place of safety to send potential victims. And that's why we believe in partnering with the local church. And the local church really is a strong place that comes in. And part of our process is actually helping the champions to find local communities of people, people that can partner together and support that work. As you know, churches would be a great place to start networking and working and finding the right people in terms of project managers and transit monitors and the right people we're looking for who have the right heart and vision and values for this work. And so as I've taken you from out there and analyzing the data and looking at predictive analysis and working out whether this country would help us would be been the most strategic place to do transit monitoring to disrupt human trafficking. That's kind of a little bit of the process that we would go through. And I would walk a journey generally with a champion, with a potential champion or a variety of candidates to be a potential champion and take them through who we are as love justice, take them through what transit monitoring really is, take them through what our values are and why we're. Why we're fighting this injustice and how we do it and how together we can partner to do that. And then we have some tools to help them to find the right candidates, you know, as love justice. We don't want to just parachute into a nation and start love justice nation, whichever one it is, and try and do it all ourselves. We really want to trust the locals on the ground who know the language, know the culture, have relationships there, and really empower them with the best tools to be able to fight this injustice. And we want to play our role well by equipping them with these kingdom class tools. Yeah, I would say that's probably the process that we go through to begin with. There's so much more to it, but I would start with that.
[00:24:07] Speaker C: Yeah. Sean, if you could also give us just a very quick, like, one liner who is a partner, who is a champion, who's a project manager, and who's a monitor.
[00:24:18] Speaker A: Brilliant. So champion. Yeah. Would be the person who we go to first to find out is this the right person? And they would be a strong believer with great connections in that country who's willing to take on this pilot, to start a pilot project with us and take on our tools and find the right people and sign an MoU with us.
[00:24:38] Speaker C: Would you say that they're kind of the equivalent to the president of a board, someone who's volunteering their time, someone who is feel, who feels really called to this work and they are kind of the point person for then the work in the field?
[00:24:53] Speaker A: Yeah, that's right. And they would typically be either on a board or the kind of, you know, chair of a board within a country that's already got a registered NGO or charitable entity there. And then the partner, the partner organization would be effectively that an organization that has registration administration in the country that can get the permissions, has got a bank account so that we can send resources legitimately and there's accountability with those resources. So the partner organization would be someone who is passionate about fighting this injustice with us, shares our values, and is willing to, you know, to report on compliance issues, report on the finances. We send and send monthly reports about the work that they're doing, and then is able, in the HR sense, to be able to employ, take on staff members like a project manager, transit monitors, etcetera. That would be the champion, then the partner organization, and then perhaps I could defer to Briony, as she's really worked on project managers and what the best project manager looks like and who this would be. So, Bryony, can I defer to you to answer that question about a project manager and monitors?
[00:26:04] Speaker D: Absolutely. I'm so passionate. I think about that part of our core competency about finding the right people, because I really do think that the right people make or break a transit monitoring project. And so a project manager is one of the key people that is the most important, I think, to find the right person. It's someone who's going to really lead the, the teams on the ground in terms of daily operation, in terms of dealing with the obstacles and issues that come along every day, if not every hour. And they're the ones really supporting and sewing into the monitoring teams on the ground. And the really great project managers are just driven, they're passionate, they've got a broken heart for injustice.
And they really need their teams rather than, I think, the project manager title kind of just assumes that one is just doing the project management. And really, these are leaders. They're the visionaries. They are the people who are serving their teams, who are doing the really hard work in the front lines. And then the monitors, they're lost. But they are first in our organization because they really are the rock stars of this whole operation. And without them, we wouldn't be able to do a fraction of this work, if anything at all. And they are the amazing men and women on the front lines who are standing in strategic transit locations looking for signs of human trafficking, talking to people to uncover the hidden signs of human trafficking. And they're the ones that go the extra mile to make sure that people are safe and that traffickers are behind bars. And, yeah, we love the incredible people that we get to work with across the world.
[00:28:01] Speaker C: Yeah, I think something, too, that it pleasantly surprises me every time I get to interact with a partner champion, project manager Monitor, is that all of them are here for the same reason. And that's because they feel called to this work and because they felt like God led them. And each of them have their own so incredibly wild and unique story of how God led them to love justice, that I am in awe every time, every time I walk away from the field, every time I walk away from a conversation and say, how did you get connected with love justice? Those stories are. I hope you get to highlight them because those stories are just incredible. And it is that posture of kind of fixing our gaze upward instead of getting so focused in on the details. I think just pausing, looking up and reminding ourselves we're all brothers and sisters in Christ. And it's so amazing how God has led each of us to be a part of this organization. So just want to echo what Brian was saying and also come back, Sean, just really quickly, to the partner idea, because this is, I think, unique. I think this is unique. And we have, like, we did start our expansion, starting love justice x country, our own entity and registration, and we kind of pivoted away from that. And one of the reasons I think, for that, and correct me if I'm wrong, because you know way more about this than I do, is that by working with partners, we're able to be more in line with our core value of fail fast and often. Because when you don't put all of the time, energy, resources into setting up your own entity from the get go, that you don't know, is going to be effective or nothing. That's where partnering with those partners becomes really, really handy, because you're able to do those quick, cheap pilots to see.
Does this affirm our research that we can do transit monitoring here? Yes. Great, let's keep going. And then maybe eventually we might set up our own entity depending on five, six, seven years out. But because we work with partners, it's really easy to test those pilots out early on without a lot of investment.
[00:30:04] Speaker A: Yeah, absolutely. And we found, you know, trying to register an entity in a country can sometimes take three to five years, and it's a very costly process. And part of the challenges of registering an entity is almost like we become the mothership, as it were, and we create this kind of dependency or this expectation of huge resources, or we're this big ngo with a lot of resources, and it can create a little bit of lethargy on the ground. But when we become the organization that works for the partner, so we're not just a donor entity, but we're actually working with the partner on the ground and helping them to get the greatest impact that they can. It changes the way they view love justice, too. The partner views love justice is that we're working together to, to get great impact. And we want to focus our time, energy and resources on creating these tools and helping them to be truly successful in their nation. And then we can empower them to do what they do best for us. It would take us two to three years to even start understanding the nature of trafficking in their country, the nature of the relationship between governments and registering entities, etcetera. And that just takes time, energy, effort.
[00:31:21] Speaker B: I.
[00:31:21] Speaker A: And we've learned that we've done, there are so many pitfalls to us trying to do that on our own in a country. And so I think that was why we pivoted this way. And some of the lessons we've learned, you know, fail fast enough, admit our weaknesses. Part of our values is love justice. I wanted to come back to something, if you don't mind, just to say, one of the things I've loved about champions and partners is praying together with them and really seeking God together about this partnership. And so it's kind of one of the first things we go into this idea of partnership together with is this what God's calling us to together. And I asked the champion that and the partner organization, you know, can we take time to pray over this? We would typically take three to six months, sometimes even two and a half years, as is the case with one of our partners now praying, seeking God, working through a variety of these processes that I'd mentioned earlier, you know, to really trust God, seek God and ensure that everything is in place for the greatest level of success in their country.
[00:32:29] Speaker C: Yeah, I mean, what Sean's not telling all of our listeners is that he's the right person for this role. And he's so well connected and completely, like, not showcasing, you know, his strengths. I mean, like, he is, you know, inadvertently. But what he's not telling you is that before we had Sean on the team, it was like we were throwing random darts at the map and saying, where do we want to go and who can we reach out to? We have some research. But once Sean was brought on the team, his network and his connections and just his ministry in all and connections and all these different continents is really what I think took our expansion to the next level. Level, not only accessibility in different countries, but finding the right people.
Sean, can you tell us a little bit about what it's like to get permission from local authorities to do this work? I think that's a very, very common question that we get from our partners, donors, people who are curious about love justice. Can you briefly share a little bit about what that's like?
[00:33:34] Speaker A: Yeah, that's a tough question to answer in one way, because it is so different in every different nation, depending on the nature of the relationship between the partner organization champion and the authorities. And often what we found is that sometimes authorities are not willing to put their stamp or signature on a particular document to say, yes, officially, you have permission to monitor in this location, they would generally give us verbal permission and say, yes, the work you're doing is great, but we don't want to take the risk and put a signature on a document. Let's see how you do first. And so sometimes it takes us quite a while, even with the verbal permissions and the acknowledgement. But once we've been able to, we found that the best way to do that is to really offer our tools and training to some of those in authority. And they've loved the fact that we're not coming in to show how they've failed, but really to support them in their efforts to get it right in their nation. And as we come with a humble approach and offering our tools and training to government officials and authorities, and we've started that with a kind of letter of intent to show the authorities, this is what we want to help you do in your country. This is the experience we've had. So as love, Justice International and the. I mean, just over 62,000 intercepts, right. To date. As we're able to show that and show the research that we've done, the data that we've been able to have and the ability that we've had to help the authorities to get these arrests and convictions. Just over a 1500. 1500 arrests to date with like over 30% conviction rate. That actually helps make a way for these kinds of permissions to be granted. But it isn't easy. That's. That's the honest truth. To get that permission granted on paper. Most often it's verbal. And we don't like to operate if we don't have that relationship with the government. We don't want to put the teams in these countries under the pressure of operating without permission or acknowledgement from the authorities because it's important for the safety of the teams on the ground that they do have the support of local authorities and their knowledge of what they're doing there. We're not an undercover operation, right. We're not doing rescues and bashing down doors. We really want to do it in partnership with the local authorities.
[00:36:08] Speaker B: It's so good. And I think what's amazing, and I agree, Hannah, to your point, that's a question I get a lot. I mean, just that practical side of do they have permission to be there to do this?
And just. It's not. I imagine, like you said, it's not an easy process at all. So from each of you guys, like, what's a story that really stands out to you? That. That it can be from the last few months, it can even be from the duration of the time you've done this. But Bryony, why don't you go first and just share a story that really stands out to you, that highlights how this anti trafficking work that we do is not only impactful, but different. And you've seen the incredible results of it.
[00:36:56] Speaker D: So my first thought is about an anecdote that our friends, Indonesia, our partners, are an organization called Compassion first. And I was actually reading an interview that was done with them in an online magazine. And they said that since they had been operating at a single port, a harbor and in Indonesia, that trafficking trains had changed and that they had heard that traffickers in that area were now recruited, recruiting girls from a different province because they knew that they couldn't get girls out of that port in that province. And I thought two things, because at first it sounds like a win, right? But on the other hand, I was like, oh, my goodness, we need to be in that other province after that. And that just shows me two really important things about this work. And it's kind of really driven me a lot in the last couple of weeks. And something that I keep coming back to is, one, just the power and importance of just constantly adapting to changing trends. And this is not something that is common in a lot of other fields, right, where, you know, you're doing a lot of the same work in the same places in the same way. This work really requires you to consistently be adapting. And that consistently adapting is so critical to disruption, and disruption is so critical to reaching that ultimate tipping point that we're after. Right?
And then the second thing that has really. It has really sort of motivated me and inspired me in, is that we have to be everywhere that is important, right? We have to be everywhere that is strategic to be. Otherwise, what about those next girls?
And that's not to say that the lives that we're saving in one case aren't extraordinarily important and precious. And my prayer consistently is that God where we aren't and there are potential victims moving through, put someone else in their heart, put someone else in their path to intervene at that critical moment. And I just trust that the Lord is doing that in his way. And that that is beyond my comprehension.
But it just. It drives me because I. I value each life, and I know that we do this work for the one, but I am on a mission, and I know that my colleagues and our partners are, too, is to disrupt this thing entirely. And we have to be in that next spot and then that one after that and in that next bus terminal in order to do this work. I think at a level that is kingdom class, we. I feel like we're only touching the tip of iceberg in terms of what can actually be accomplished. And that's fine. We're building and we're growing and we're improving along the way. But that story has been really powerful and has really sat on my heart in the last couple of weeks since I'm with it.
[00:40:17] Speaker A: Well, this resonates with Bryony's, you know, testimony. Every day we get to hear stories of people who were going to be trafficked but are now in the safety of their homes or in a. A shelter or somewhere safe that they can be loved, nurtured, protected, and empowered. And I really love the stories where we've been able to love and serve and intercept someone who's about to be exploited and really sent them home to be part of a strong local community and empower their families with the knowledge of human trafficking. Many of them didn't even know what human trafficking is, right? And we've sent them back home, empowered their families, and they're now empowered to teach and educate their community about this. And so from that story of, you know, vulnerability and poverty to that false promise, all the way to them becoming advocates, you know, and protecting their community from human trafficking, those are the stories that I love. I remember a recent story, particularly of a fishing vessel that came into Namibia, the port in Namibia. And I got involved in this, and because we had partners around the world in different countries, because there were five nationalities on this fishing vessel, and they couldn't really speak the local language, they couldn't speak English. And so we were able to use our networks to get people from five different countries around the world to be able to speak to these different folks on this fishing vessel. Initially, the authorities wanted to arrest the. I think there were 45 potential victims on this fishing vessel, and the authorities wanted to arrest them for, you know, for crossing illegally without permits to work on this fishing vessel. They were actually trafficked into these waters and we were able to help translation, the project manager and monitors in Namibia, to be able to secure their freedom for them and safe passage back home. Some of them from the Philippines, someone from Japan, China and other nations. And just seeing the collaboration around the world between our different partners, that's something that I think we've grown more and more to see. The opportunity for collaboration and seeing the different nations working together has really resonated with me. One quick more story. Just last week, I heard a project manager was telling me the story of a young, eleven year old girl who came from a poor family. She was selling plantain like bananas in the local market. And a man in a really nice vehicle came over to her and said, hey, I have a factory and I can provide for you many of these, you know, I won't even charge you for them until you've sold them. So offering her this great opportunity, he says, but you have to come with me now. Come with me and come and see the factory and I'll give them to you. We can load up my car and get you back here with a lot more stock than what you have. She's only eleven years old. She trusted this guy, jumped in the car, he locked the doors and kept her in the car and then said to her, threatened her. And I believe the project manager had mentioned to me he was about to take her to, for an organ transplant, going to sell her organs. And that's one of the forms of trafficking that I, that really gets to me, you know, burdens me. Fortunately, when he stopped to try and get money exchanged, she managed to escape through the door and one of our monitors was right there. One of the monitors in Freetown in Sierra Leone was right there, saw her young girl running away from this car and intercepted AnHEJDEHe what's going on and was able to get her to safety. And these kinds of stories exist every day and really this motivates us to keep going, you know, despite the challenges and difficulties that inspires us to keep going and get people to safety and freedom.
[00:44:23] Speaker C: Jason, I don't know how you're feeling, but like, you know, you talk to the foundations of our program staff and how can you not get excited about that? How can you not just get so pumped up? You know, you have John, you have these guys and the, the fun part is that we just have more, we just have more of this, we have more conversations. We're going to get into even more depths and different crevices of the organization that I think not a lot of people know about and that we just haven't, you know, had the platform to be able to share about it. Like I like this podcast, so it's really, really exciting. And I also think about, you know, the listener who has an eleven year old daughter and is listening to this and is feeling so stirred by this conversation and thinking like what can I do? You know, what can I do? How can I involve this? These testimonies are moving, this model is compelling. Bryony, share with us a little bit about what people can do and how they can get involved.
[00:45:26] Speaker D: Absolutely, Hannah. I mean, just to start off with, I think the right people, right? Like if you can connect us to the right people that we're looking for either in different nations or within love justice International, we have an incredibly detailed and long careers website page and we were looking for people to fill some really important controls. And so if you can take a look and connect us to someone that you know, or if a job resonates with you, would love to hear from you and love to chat.
We have an incredible prayer ministry as well. Every week, praying multiple times into the areas where we're seeking breakthrough, but also giving praise where praise is needed. Right. There's some incredible mountains that get moved on a day key basis and we love celebrating with our prayer warriors across the world.
And then lastly giving, giving up your time if you want to volunteer, giving up your resources if you want to fund this work, it really doesn't take a lot to save a life, but we've got a lot of lives that need to be saved, Eric. And so if you could give generously and sacrificially, I think that I can promise you as the director of anti trafficking, that I will ensure personally that your resources are well invested where they're going to make the most impact. And so please rest assured that your investments into fighting the world's greatest injustices is safe. With love. Justice.
[00:47:04] Speaker C: Yeah, I get a heart attack, Jason, because these two are actually, like, responsible for all of our expansion. So at any given time, they probably have ten countries that they're ready to pilot in. And I just, my heart palpitates thinking about all the training and compliance and.
[00:47:21] Speaker A: You know, 1515 countries.
[00:47:22] Speaker C: Hannah, we all work very, very closely together, but I think that's like, but we all work really well, and each of us has a role to play. And that goes back to just what you were saying, brittney. Like, the body is made up of many parts, and just like, we each have a role to play in this model, and Jason has a role to play within love, justice. Our volunteers, our givers, our prayer prayers.
I don't think I said that right. But those who are praying for this work, you know, everyone has a role to play. And I think the encouragement would be just do something. What is it that you can do and just do the one thing and let God move in that one small, obedient. Yes.
[00:48:07] Speaker B: I love it. I love it. And I agree with you. My heart beats fast every time I hear our stories, every time I understand the potential of expansion, every time I think about Briney.
We need just this much more of resources to help get one more expansion and one more pilot and one more. And to know that as we plan and as we strategize, one of the things we're working on, on the state side, for our listeners, for our viewers, depending upon how you're looking, engaging with us on this, we really are trying to figure out if you can't get a career with us or you can't go intern with us or you can't jump in in that way, that puts you out in the programmatic side. What's a way that even here in the state, you can volunteer. And so we're working on that, too, and just to expand those opportunities so people can be involved. But you said it so well. All three of you actually did. But, Bryony, just something you said just a second ago, like one of our ladies that I've been talking to that's not only a donor, but someone that'll end up probably being on our board. And we were talking, and she's so enthusiastic about the work, and her passion is telling people of any income, of any means who live in any economic status that exists in any particular economic status, how little it takes to pay for an interception, what our cost per intercept is. And she is passionate about it.
I think regardless of how big or little of a gift you can give or what it is that you feel like you can do, yes, this is something you want to be involved in. The impact is clear, the need is clear. And even hearing the two stories that you guys just shared, or the three that you guys just shared, I mean, it's just so obvious, isn't it? And so I think what's so significant and exciting to me, and it's been mentioned several times in this, and it really is that our vision, which is, to me, so compelling to be a part of our vision, is so clear.
We want to do whatever it takes to cause the tipping point that leads to the collapse of the human trafficking industry. And if you want to be a part of that, I can't think of a better organization to partner with. And so, you know, we are doing everything we can to amplify that story. And so if you're listening, if you're watching this, like, help us amplify that story, jump in, get involved, volunteer, give. If you're interested even in going overseas or having an internship or looking at a career, there are certainly those opportunities, too. But get involved and help us. Help us cultivate, do the hard work, fight to prevent human trafficking and cause that to be point. And so you guys, I mean, seriously, you said it so well, Hannah, that these are such foundational pillars of who we are as an organization and the work that you guys do, our transit monitors certainly are the true heroes. And I agree with you, Bryony, but you guys are heroes as well. And the work that you're doing and the way you're so prayerfully looking to expand and so prayerfully leading us to be as effective as possible in the various places where we are. And so maybe, you know, real quick, last word. Give you a chance to say a last word and we'll wrap up.
[00:51:46] Speaker A: Well, it's just been such a joy to hang out with you guys on this podcast and really share part of our work with folks around the world.
The thing we value the most is really pray. Keep praying with us and for us, and let's fight this injustice together, you know, no small deed, no small prayer.
Our God is so huge. Isn't he just? And he can do so many things in answer to one prayer than we can do on the front lines of trying to fight this. Because without him, you know, nothing happens without him. He's sovereign, he's all powerful, and he loves to use us to accomplish his purposes. What a privilege we have of doing that together as love justice International.
[00:52:32] Speaker D: I think my last word is that there are very few opportunities in this life to really change someone else's life. Like an opportunity to do that is really precious and really valuable.
And I think just to say to all the boners that are listening, just thank you. Thank you for allowing us to do this work and to consistently do more of it. And we see you and those of us who are sort of working on the program side of things, like, I am truly overwhelmed by just the consistent generosity from donors and just grateful for all of those who listened, who've been prompted by the spirit to give and whatever way, shape, or form they can and have done. And I feel, yeah, a real obligation to ensure that, that those resources, those. Every dollar, every rand, every kwacha is spent really wisely. So just to say thank you and to those who are considering it, I think to just say whether it's love, justice, or somewhere else. And, yeah, that these opportunities don't come across too often. And so I just invite you to take, take that first leap and give, and I just know that the Lord will.
Yeah. Just be so grateful for your obedience in that moment.
[00:54:00] Speaker C: Jason, this has been such a treat and such a delight talking with Sean and Bryony this, this afternoon or morning for you. We're also navigating different time zones.
Thank you guys so much for taking the time out of your super busy schedules to be with us. I know that that's not, you know that we don't take that lightly. We know that you have a lot of other things that you could be doing and spending your time on, and so we just really appreciate you taking the last hour to be with us.
[00:54:26] Speaker B: Absolutely. I fully agree, and I can't thank you enough. I mean, these may seem like small things, but this resource and this content that you've shared, these, the way you've communicated things today, can become really important and helping people not only understand it, but be compelled to give, be compelled to be a part. And so, really, thank you so much. Bryony, Sean, both of you. Hannah, it's always so fun to get on with you and I'm so grateful for you and also the work that you do.
And so just look forwarding. Look forward. Excuse me, to the next episode. And in the meantime, you guys, thanks so much. We'll be praying. Keep doing the incredible work and the impactful work that you're doing.
[00:55:11] Speaker A: Thank you. Thank you. Such a joy.
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